Lemur Species, It's been suggested before, but I can explain why it'd be a re Options

[Zahzu]

I've read the "Frequently Suggested Avatars" sticky and gone over some of the topics suggesting lemurs as a species... And I've noticed some kind of inaccurate comments being made about them. The most common ones being "primates are too much like humans" and "a lemur is so specific that it would be really limited as an avatar". I personally find these to be rather inaccurate, but that's probably because I've studied lemurs more than most.

Lemurs are a strepsirhini prosimian (which basically translates as pre-monkey), and prosimians are often regarded as a "lesser primate". They are considered to be less "advanced" than monkeys because the strepsirhini (meaning wet-nosed) prosimians retain a lot of so-called primitive features that are seen in many other animals. Namely- they have a longer snout (depending on the species) and a wet nose like many other mammals! Although it's not as defined as say a dog (I could explain exactly why, but it would make my post even longer), it's still wet and doesn't look too much like a simian or ape's- and certainly not like a person. Lemurs rely almost entirely on scent-based and vocal communications, as opposed to simians and apes which rely much more on visual signals.
Although lemurs do have hands and feet, each with opposable thumbs, the shape (especially on the feet) are very different from those of a human, and really they're quite different from even simians and other apes.

I have a very simple (Note: Very simple. Like, incredibly simple. Don't use this to study for an anatomy class because you will fail.) guide to some of the lemurs' many unique features, which can be found HERE.
The lemur sections point out a few of the basic features that 98% of people are completely clueless about, such as the shape of the feet, the 1 grooming claw on each foot, and their very strange and unique dentition.


Regarding to the subject of "a lemur player being limited", I think that's a bit unfair as there are over 100 different species (and a couple subspecies) of living lemurs currently recognized, with even more that have been discovered but are either waiting to be officially announced, or just awaiting further analysis to determine if they really are a new species. All of the lemurs look incredibly different, each with completely unique appearances, behaviors, social systems, widely different sounds, as well as anatomical differences. I think there are plenty of opportunities to be had for characters. The only big issue you would have is that many lemur species look so vastly different from each-other that the avatar wouldn't fit for all of them, especially those within different genuses. :P

Although lemurs aren't the most popular characters out there, they do get quite a bit of attention (at least as much, if not more, than bats), and there really isn't any avatar out there that fits for them. They aren't even distantly related to any of the species available- Their closest relatives are the Colugos and Tree Shrews, but scientists have been researching into the idea that Flying Foxes might be a very close relative as well, which could really shake things up for taxonomists... Anyhow, regardless, there aren't any similar species to choose from, and the closest taxonomic relative (rodents) look completely different in appearance than any lemur. Because of this, those of us who do have lemur characters really have no species to turn to on Furcadia! I frequently set my avatar to either feline or canine- as I can never decide which one almost resembles a lemur- but it misleads and confuses people which is something that personally bothers me.

A slightly nitpicky thing with me and the avatars: I've considered setting my avatar to a scurine but I dislike the avatar itself and the tail is much too large. A lemur's tail is really not very big and poofy- I'd compare it to something inbetween the tail of a long-haired and short-haired cat. With the feline and canine avatars, the tail is the wrong shape in both (they don't have a poof at the end as in the feline, and the tail doesn't come to a point as in the canine), and neither species has a long enough tail. A lemur's tail is longer than it's entire body length, and (depending on the species) is often held upright in an 'S' shape.
I think this detail, and some of the other details, are just me going too far in-depth with it... All the same, they're still things that the other avatars just can't fit.


So, now back to the main topic! If a lemur avatar was ever to be made, there are many species you could choose from to make it unique from the other avatars, if that's something you're looking for.


I think some examples of Lemur species that would be good as general avatars are:
- Ring-Tailed Lemurs (Lemur catta). Personally, these are actually one of my least favorite lemur species, even though my main character happens to be one! But they are the most well-known of the species and the most commonly seen in characters.

- A general Ruffed Lemur (Varecia sp.). There are 2 species of Ruffed Lemur, and the Black and White Ruffed has 3 subspecies, so there are 4 different lemurs right there. As well, the Ruffed Lemur avatar could also work for Black Lemurs (Eulemur macaco macaco), Sanford's Brown Lemurs (Eulemur sanfordi), and Red-Bellied Lemurs (Eulemur rubriventer). Making for a total of 7 species in 1 avatar.

- A general avatar for Eulemur sp. This can cover the 4 Brown Lemur subspecies (Eulemur fulvus fulvus, E. f. mayottensis, E. f. rufus and E. f. albifrons), the Collared Lemurs (Eulemur collaris and Eulemur albocollaris), Blue-Eyed Black Lemur (Eulemur macaco flavifrons), Crowned Lemur (Eulemur coronatus), and Mongoose Lemur (Eulemur mongoz)- At least 9 species.

- General Sifaka (Propithecus sp.). Although the general shape of the face and such could almost qualify these guys as species that would work with the Eulemur general avatar, the Sifakas have such a different type of locomotion that it wouldn't be quite right... That is, if you just kept your character accurate to that, which I doubt most people do- I don't even do it with my Sifaka characters! Anyhow, these guys are the bipedal, sideways-hopping lemurs you hear about on Zoboomafoo and Disney's Dinosaur. My guess is that the leaping animation may be hard to animate as an anthro, but they did it for the rabbit so I'm sure it could work somehow. :P This could work for at least the 8 major Sifaka species (Propithecus' verreauxi, coquereli, deckeni, coronatus, edwardsi, diadema, perrieri and candidus), and probably the Golden-Crowned Sifaka (P. tattersali) as well, although their ear tufts are differently shaped than the others. It would also probably work for all the other bipedal-leaping lemurs, which adds another 40+ species! These include all 8 Bamboo lemurs (Hapalemur griseus griseus, H. g. ranomafanensis, H. g. gilberti; H. alaotriensis, occidentalis, meridionalis, aureus and Prolemur simus), the 9 Avahis (Avahi betsileo, cleesei, laniger, meridionalis, mooreorum, occidentalis, peyrierasi, ramanantsoavana, unicolor), and all 25 Sportive Lemurs (Lepilemur sp.) which I'm not even going to list on here, ha ha! It may also work for the Indri (Indri indri), although they have more defined ears and a stump of a tail, so they might be able to pass with just the bear avatar. A grand total of 52 species- That's more than the Ursine has to it's name!

- General Cheirogaleus sp. avatar. This would work for all 17 species of Mouse Lemurs (Microcebus sp.), the 7 species of Dwarf Lemurs (Cheirogaleus medius, major, crossleyi, sibreei, adipicaudatus, minisculus, ravus), the 4 Fork-Marked Lemurs (Phaner furcifer, parienti, electromontis, pallenscens), both Giant Mouse Lemurs (Mirza zaza and Mirza coquereli), and perhaps the Hairy-Eared Dwarf Lemur (Allocebus trichotis) as well. A possible 31 different species.

The Aye-Aye (Daubentonia madagascariensis) I think wouldn't be the best idea for a single avatar, because in this case it really WOULD be highly limited. Aye-Ayes are incredibly specialized animals- no other lemurs look like them, and no other animals on Earth for that matter! You could probably pass an Aye-Aye character with the Cheirogaleus avatar, or if nothing else then the Rodent avatar would work fairly well!




Whew, that's a lot to read! I'm sure it probably bored you all to death, but eh- I think the idea of a Lemur avatar of some sort really isn't as scary as some people think.
I agree with most people that a haplorhini primate (Tarsiers, simians and apes) avatar would be a bit too human-like to make a proper anthro... I've never been a fan of those primates, anyhow, and I rarely ever see them as anthro characters... But when you learn about what a lemur actually is, they really aren't too human-like to be anthropomorphized, and they definitely aren't limited! :D

[Blood Rose Castle]

This was a very nicely detailed suggestion.

My only critique: provide images to boost your talking points. =D

Sure it's easy to talk about how they look, but if you don't show it, how are the developers supposed to decided if it would work?

[Kamose]

Regarding to the subject of "a lemur player being limited", I think that's a bit unfair as there are over 100 different species (and a couple subspecies) of living lemurs currently recognized, with even more that have been discovered but are either waiting to be officially announced, or just awaiting further analysis to determine if they really are a new species.

Most of the free avatars are at the order or family level, so from that perspective, a lemur isn't any more specific. (Lemurs belong to the same infraorder, which ranks between order and family.)

Currently, we have a squirrel/skunk avatar that represents two animals that are not very closely related, scientifically speaking, but bear some resemblance to each other. (Squirrels and skunks belong to two different orders; squirrels are members of Rodentia, and skunks are members of Carnivora.)

I think that a lemur avatar could be used the same way to represent both lemurs and other animals, such as raccoons and red pandas. Although these animals don't look exactly alike, at the resolution used in Furcadia's graphics, they would look similar enough to share an avatar.

[LoverofPonys]

Oh CRAP!

You really want a lemur avatar! You are such a good writer but I hardly have time to post let alone read HUGE entrys! I love the idea, I second to idea (if somebody hasn't already ), but keep the post at least 2 paragraphs shorter next time! LOL.



I SECOND THE IDEA!

[Seley]

I'd say when we're able to swap out tails on avatars, then a striped tail suitable for a lemur, raccoon, tanuki, red panda, etc. will probably be available at some point.